Handtops, UMPC - Cell phones with fast data transfer

01/11/06 + MeanSquare

This is a thread specifically for listing which cell phones allow data transfer to handhelds with little or no speed degredation. (Apparently some units lose a lot of speed when using Bluetooth.) The purpose is to provide an easy to locate spot for potential buyers to see which phones to look for and which to avoid.

I suggest the following convention:
Place "Fast" in the topic line of well-behaved phones that allow full speed data transfers
and "Slow" in the topic line of poorly-behave phones. That way, a search will immediately pick out the useful items.

Recent Blog: MeanSquare's Review of the Sony UX (with comparison to OQO)

edited: Jan 11 2006 + tnkgrl

I suggest people list:
- The geographical area
- The phone used (make/mode & OS)
- The cariier used
- The plan used
- The connection used (Bluetooth/USB/PC-card)
- The computer used (make/model & OS)
- The web browser used
- The version (for Bluetooth - both devices)
- The radio/dongle used (for Bluetooth)
- The stack/driver used (for Bluetooth - in Windows)

I also suggest people use this link and pick Seattle (that's where Speakeasy is located)

Recent Blog: Bluetooth hack for the Asus 701 (Eee)

edited: Jan 12 2006 + rcurrier

SPEED KILLER SLOW AUDIOVOX XV6600:

- The geographical area (Chicago)
- The phone used (make/mode & OS) (AudioVox XV6600)
- The cariier used (Verizon)
- The plan used (BroadBandAccess)
- The connection used (Bluetooth/USB/PC-card) (Bluetooth)
- The computer used (make/model & OS) (Sony U750P)
- The web browser used (MS IE latest version)
- The version (for Bluetooth - both devices) (I believe 1.1 on both--not entirely certain however; definitely not 2 on either device)
- The radio/dongle used (for Bluetooth) (official Sony Bluetooth dongle)
- The stack/driver used (for Bluetooth - in Windows) (Widcomm? see my comments in another post below)

Note: trust me when I say that the AudioVox XV6600 at least when I bought it back in January 2005 could *not* via bluetooth transfer Verizon evdo data to a Sony U750P without experiencing 60 to 70% speed degradation. It would take 400-500 kbps on the phone and instantly turn it into 100 to 240 kbps tops on the computing device.

I spoke extensively with 3rd level Verizon techs who were located right on a Verizon tower and they absolutely confirmed that the problem was with the XV 6600 bluetooth stack. They called AudioVox high level techs themselves and confirmed it. At that time, AudiVox didn't have any near term fixes available. I do not know whether they ever came up with a driver to fix it. I don't think this phone is sold that much any more. More advanced models have apparently replaced it.

edited: Jan 11 2006 + tnkgrl

*rcurrier* what OS is running on the AudioVox (WM 5) and what OS is running on the Sony U (XP service pack 2)? Also do you have a "My Bluetooth Places" item in Windows explorer (Widcomm stack) or just a Bluetooth logo in your system tray (MS stack)? Please report.

Recent Blog: Bluetooth hack for the Asus 701 (Eee)

01/12/06 + educationk12

verizon has that new blackberry which is the only phone that verizon allows tethering...does anybody own it?

treo 700w would be nice but dont know if it can b tethered.

im STILL waiting for kyocera KR1 pcard router to wifi and/or the pccard to usb adaptor.

i really dont want to charge a device.

edited: Jan 12 2006 + rcurrier

Tnkgrl, the following website

link

says that the AudioVox XV6600 does *not* use the Microsoft Bluetooth stack. What does that leave remaining? the Widcomm stack? are there only two Bluetooth stack standards? MS and Widcomm? if there are only two standards, and the link above is correct in stating that the XV6600 does not use the Microsoft bluetooth stack, then, by default, the XV6600 must use the widcomm stack.

?

01/12/06 + tnkgrl

*rcurrier*, I want to know if your Sony U used the MS BT stack or the Widcomm BT stack... Do you remember seeing "My Bluetooth Places" in Windows Explorer?

Recent Blog: Bluetooth hack for the Asus 701 (Eee)

01/12/06 + rcurrier

I can't remember. I don't think so because the Sony U750P doesn't have bluetooth built into it like the oQo and many other computers. I had to buy a Sony bluetooth usb dongle to use bluetooth with it.

Does that answer your question? I think the answer is neither. Or, in the alternative, the stack used is whatever came with the installation software with the Sony bluetooth dongle, and I don't know what that might happen to be.

?

01/12/06 + fil

tnkgrl said: "I want to know if your Sony U used the MS BT stack or the Widcomm BT stack... Do you remember seeing "My Bluetooth Places" in Windows Explorer?"

The U doesn't have built-in Bluetooth like the OQO.

Many U owners use a Socket, Orange, or other CompactFlash or USB BT adapter.
All of these BT cards use their own drivers and do not rely on Microsoft XP's limited BT stack.

I have a USB Orange BT adapter and it support headsets, earphones, DUN, etc.

That's why the OQO BT stack (using MS BT on XP SP2) is so disappointing.

Recent Blog: Apple iPhone Switch

01/12/06 + tnkgrl

*fil*, I agree with you... However, most third party BT radios/dongles use the Widcomm stack, and the MS stack - despite supporting only a limited number of profiles - appears to provide good DUN data rates. So it's probably a good idea to know the type of stack being used!

Recent Blog: Bluetooth hack for the Asus 701 (Eee)

edited: Jan 13 2006 + rcurrier

Tnkgirl, what you say above makes sense then as to why I couldn't get any decent speed transfer between theAudioVox XV6600 and the Sony U750P with the U750P having the official Sony Bluetooth dongle plugged into the U750P's usb port.

You indicate dongles are usually usually widcomm and we know for a fact, based on the link I supply above, that the AudioVox XV6600 is using the widcomm stack (because the link says it isn't using the MS stack).

With both devices using the non-MS poorly-performing-in-terms-of-data-transferring DUN-deficient widcomm stack (as you indicate), no wonder I was experiencing never ending 60 to 70 percent speed degradation.

01/14/06 + tnkgrl

*rcurrier*, three things:

1) I don't think the Widcomm stack is available for Windows Mobile - I was referring to Windows XP
2) I'm not saying the Widcomm stack performs poorly for DUN - I'm saying that the MS stack performs well
3) Most BT dongles are supplied with the Widcomm stack - I don't know about the Sony dongle though

All that being cleared up, it appears that the combination of the BT stack for your AudioVox (in Windows Mobile) and the BT stack for your Sony dongle (in Windows XP) is bad for DUN.

Also, there is no requirement within the BT spec about which profiles a devce should support, so MS just picked the most commonly used ones.

Recent Blog: Bluetooth hack for the Asus 701 (Eee)

edited: Jan 14 2006 + rcurrier

Tnkgrl, the link I suppied above clearly says that the AudioVox XV6600 running WM3 does not use the MicroSoft bluetooth stack. Since I thought that there are apparently only two standards, doesn't that mean that, by default, the XV6600 with Windows Mobile 3 must be running the widcomm bluetooth stack (and not the Microsoft stack)?

Here's the link again

link

and here's the pertinent copy and paste from the link above:

*The following devices do not use the Microsoft Bluetooth stack. BlueSchedule unfortunately does not currently support turning on and off the Bluetooth on these devices:

*Audiovox XV6600*
Dell Axim X50/X50v
HP iPAQ h6340
HP iPAQ h6365
i-mate PDA2k
MDAIII (T-Mobile)
NZ Telecom Harrier
Qtek 9090
SPV M2000 (Orange)
SX66 (Siemens)
VPx (Vodafone)
XDAIIs
XDAIII (O2 Germany)*

>>>Finally, specifically, why do you say that DUN works so well on MS bluetooth stack? To say something works well, it seems like you're possibly making a comparison (like how does a person really know that vanilla tastes great if they've never tried chocolate), and, if so, and if there's only two standards, that comparison is being made, by default, to the widcomm stack. Have you ever heard anything bad about widcomm stack and DUN bluetooth internet transfer speed degradation?

01/14/06 + tnkgrl

*rcurrier* I know the MS stack works well for DUN, and that's good enough for me! I don't really use the missing profiles and I like the fact that it's built into Windows XP SP2 - I've also heard and read about people having problems with the Widcomm stack... As a result I've not tried the Widcomm stack, and without a point of reference, I can't directly compare it to the MS stack.

And just FYI, I'm pretty sure there are BT stacks other than the MS stack and the Widcomm stack, but I don't know anything about them.

Recent Blog: Bluetooth hack for the Asus 701 (Eee)

01/15/06 + educationk12

Has anybody heard of anyone who has tethered the Treo 700W successfully?

Actually, all I want is the Kyocera KR1 evdo wifi thing to come out and then it doesn't matter as much. That was another November product release date...and now it's mid-jan.